Recent Posts - DAFNE Online

Nov 13, 2012

novorapidboi26 1,819 posts

Topic: General Discussion / One unit of insulin to ten grams carbs ratio

I think for most DAFNE graduates they will take a incremental approach to dose adjustment.

If 1:1 (1:10) is not enough for you then you would increase that to 1.5:1 (1.5:10), this makes its easier to calculate more achievable insulin dosages, however some people do need to get there ratio to a more accurate number eg 1.25:1, 1.75:1.

Any more precise than that and it becomes difficult to dose properly unless your on a pump.

If several days results show you need more, increase by .5 units to every 10 grams.... Wink

Nov 13, 2012

novorapidboi26 1,819 posts

Topic: General Discussion / I did it :)

Hey Nick,

I am currently still in the process of getting a pump.........

I was referred to the clinic after my consultants agreed I would benefit from one. It also helped that the pump clinic within my PCT had secured funding for 18 pumps just for the adults alone. Without this I probably wouldn't have even been considered.

I was referred in July/August and I am looking to go on the saline solution test period mid January, so not too long in the grand scheme of things. The length of time it has taken is probably down to the business of the clinic with the normal appointments..

I hope it not too long a wait....... Wink

Nov 13, 2012

Alan 49 284 posts

Topic: General Discussion / How many units of insulin?

Also: If you don't have a pen that allows you to dial up half a unit of insulin, you should round up 4.5 units to 5 units.

Nov 13, 2012

Ahmentep 99 posts

Topic: General Discussion / How many units of insulin?

Hi,

Don't be frightened by this, but this is how it works mathematically.

Insulin units = C/10 x R
Carbs = I/R x10
Ratio = I/C x 10

Where C = Carbohydrate in grams
I = Insulin in units
R = Ratio ( e.g. 1:1)

So, for the values you gave:

C/10 x R (You only use the first figure (or the top figure, depending on how the ratio is written))

30/10 x 1.5 = 4.5

I hope this helps for the future.

Kind regards,

Roger

PS
A ratio, say 1 to 1, can be written as 1 to 1 or as 1:1 or as 1/1

For a ratio of 1 to 10 these would be - 1 to 10, or 1:10 or 1/10

Nov 12, 2012

merstone 3 posts

Topic: Questions for HCPs / DAFNE view of Post-meal BG Testing

Thanks marke.
Signs of some research into the value of occasional post-meal testing were, of course, exactly what I was hoping to find from this thread. However, I guess that anything remotely conclusive in this area is unlikely, bearing in mind the longer term complications aspect would tend to make it as lengthy as the proverbial piece of string.

I therefore wonder by who and on what evidence the post-meal BG targets published in last month's Balance magazine were derived?

Nov 12, 2012

marke 681 posts

Topic: Questions for HCPs / snacking and corrections

Hi Gemsa, sorry bad news you are no longer 'normal'. What happens to 'normal' people no longer applies to you. What Carolin was trying to say was say you eat at 6pm, inject 12 units and have 120carbs ( where you are on 1:1 and 10carbs = 1 unit). If you test 1 hour later your body is still digesting the food and your BG will be higher than normal. If its 14 and you decide to correct and give yourself 3 units to bring you back to 5 ( generalising a lot about the exact
effect of insulin), you now potentially have 15 units working on 12CP's which may be too much and will force you too low. Your QA insulin will generally keep working for upto 5 hours, this is the danger of injecting between meals.
In an ideal world our BG stays within range after meals, but its not an ideal world so we are trying to make the best we can of it. If your BG is back in range before the next meal then generally you are doing ok. You can try to get better control than this but is very difficult. You don't have the feedback mechanism that a normal person has. You cannot secreet insulin at just the right time to balance the sugar in your blood, All you can do is put it into your body fat and let it be absorbed into your system at roughly the rate required. This is not precise but its as good as it gets with technology as it is at the moment. Maybe one day this will change but not in the immediate future.

Nov 12, 2012

marke 681 posts

Topic: Questions for HCPs / DAFNE view of Post-meal BG Testing

I wouldn't say it is completely unnecessary, however I would also say it is not covered in the course because no research has been conducted to prove its benefits. Its nothing to do with test strip economy more to do with the don't tell you stuff that is not backed up by research, Thats the point of DAFNE it is all backed up by research.
You will find loads of discussions on Diabetes sites regarding post-meal highs and their significance. However my personal view is most of it is not backed up by any real research just opinions. Whilst everyones opinion is valid, at the end of the day thats all it is. I have my own personal views but its not for me to tell you what is right or wrong. If there IS some solid research hopefully someone will respond with some links to it.

Nov 12, 2012

mum2westiesGill 502 posts

Topic: General Discussion / How many units of insulin?

Thank you Marian!

Nov 12, 2012

NuMo 28 posts

Topic: General Discussion / How many units of insulin?

41/2 (4.5)

Nov 12, 2012

mum2westiesGill 502 posts

Topic: General Discussion / How many units of insulin?

How many units of insulin would you have on
1.5:1 ratio
for 3 CPs / being 30g of carbs?

Nov 12, 2012

mum2westiesGill 502 posts

Topic: General Discussion / Ratios / higher number of units of insulin

DianeW said:
Hi

I think you are getting confused....1 unit of insulin would never be able to cope with 8 CPs.

Whatever amount of CPs you have, you just multiply that by your ratio (i.e. 1.5 or 2 or 2.5 or 3) for example if you were on 1.5:1 and you had 8 CPs that would be 8 x 1.5 = 12 units. If you were on 2:1 with 8 CPS you would have 8 x 2 = 16 units. So it all depends on the ratio you are on.

If you're still not sure then I would strongly suggest you talk to your own diabetic team who will be able to suggest the right ratio for you based on your readings.

Thank you DianeW. Those examples you've given me are much clearer now Very Happy

x

Nov 12, 2012

DianeW 115 posts

Topic: General Discussion / Ratios / higher number of units of insulin

Hi

I think you are getting confused....1 unit of insulin would never be able to cope with 8 CPs.

Whatever amount of CPs you have, you just multiply that by your ratio (i.e. 1.5 or 2 or 2.5 or 3) for example if you were on 1.5:1 and you had 8 CPs that would be 8 x 1.5 = 12 units. If you were on 2:1 with 8 CPS you would have 8 x 2 = 16 units. So it all depends on the ratio you are on.

If you're still not sure then I would strongly suggest you talk to your own diabetic team who will be able to suggest the right ratio for you based on your readings.

Nov 12, 2012

pfordmartin 5 posts

Topic: General Discussion / Top 5 Takeaways from DAFNE

Hi again all. I am inboxing some of you separately for your approval on quoting you in an article sidebar (Top 5 Takeaways from DAFNE). Thanks again for your input! Laughing

Best,
Paula

Nov 12, 2012

mum2westiesGill 502 posts

Topic: General Discussion / Ratios / higher number of units of insulin

DianeW said:
The answer to your question from your example woujld be 1.5:1.

1:1 is. 1 unit QA equals 1 CP *1 CP being 10g of carbs)
1.5:1 is 1.5 units QA to 1 CP (i.e. if you have 4 CPs equals 6 units QA
2:1 is 2 units QA for every 1 CP ( i.e. 4 CP equals 8 units QA)

and then the ratios increase by half at a time

Thank you.

Do you have some examples like this going up for every 8 carbs

1:8 = 1 unit of insulin for every 8 carbs

Nov 12, 2012

DianeW 115 posts

Topic: General Discussion / Ratios / higher number of units of insulin

The answer to your question from your example woujld be 1.5:1.

1:1 is. 1 unit QA equals 1 CP *1 CP being 10g of carbs)
1.5:1 is 1.5 units QA to 1 CP (i.e. if you have 4 CPs equals 6 units QA
2:1 is 2 units QA for every 1 CP ( i.e. 4 CP equals 8 units QA)

and then the ratios increase by half at a time

Nov 12, 2012

mum2westiesGill 502 posts

Topic: General Discussion / Ratios / higher number of units of insulin

1:10 = 1 unit of insulin for every 10g carbs
50g carbs would be 5u

what would be the next highest ratio / number of units of insulin?

Nov 12, 2012

Nick_G 6 posts

Topic: General Discussion / I did it :)

Out of interest how long did it take you to get the pump? I posted the other day to try and gauge how long it'll take. My post was

"Im looking for some advice from all of you insulin pumpers! I know speed and services can vary between hospitals but i wanted to gauge your experiences of waiting times.

I completed DAFNE at University Hospital of South Manchester in September and following on from a meeting with my Consultant on Tuesday i have been informed that she agrees that i should be on an insulin pump and will put the wheels in motion to request the necessary funding from my PCT which is in the Macclesfield District.I have read that as long as a consultant diabetiologist says you require a pump then your PCT cannot refuse to fund it.

Can anyone give me any advice about how long this whole process will take from beginning to end? I have been informed i will be invited to a pump meeting at the hospital at some point and once the funding is approed they will look to order the pump i want.

Am i looking at pre or post christmas?

Thank you in advance :-)"

Nov 12, 2012

Nick_G 6 posts

Topic: General Discussion / will dafne course help me?

Couldn't disagree with any of the comments above! I've been Diabetic for 20 years and I learnt more in 1 week than I have in 20 years.

My personal experience is a lot more freedom, flexibility and better Control which inevitably will improve my HBA1c.

I approached the course thinking 'they cannot tell me anything I don't already know' .......how wrong I was.

Nov 12, 2012

DianeW 115 posts

Topic: General Discussion / will dafne course help me?

I've been diabetic 32 years and did DAFNE in January and it definitely changed my view of diabetes. I had acquired bad habits, hardly used to test, never used to watch what I ate and now although far from perfect it has made me WANT to take care of myself, which is a big change in my opinion. I wish I had gone on something like it in the early days. I WANT to know what my BG is, I am curious to know if my carb intake is matching my QA, so I test regularly and thefore have better control. It gave me a much needed kick up the backside and it shows that even if you've had diabetes a long time and are stuck in your ways, it is worth going on and although it perhaps helps some more than others, it refreshes your thinking at least.

Nov 12, 2012

Garry 328 posts

Topic: General Discussion / Hypos and testing

Good on yer.
Regards
Garry

Nov 12, 2012

merstone 3 posts

Topic: Questions for HCPs / DAFNE view of Post-meal BG Testing

I noted that a recent issue of Balance magazine included a set of suggested BG targets covering pre-meal and also post-meal test scenarios. However, from my course, the DAFNE concept seemed to be that occasional testing for BG peaks (typically 2 hours after a meal) is completely unnecessary.

So is the DAFNE view of post-meal testing driven by just test strip economy, or is there some recent research to suggest that provided DAFNE pre-meal BG targets are being met, post-meal highs are too short in duration to increase the risk of longer term complications?

Nov 11, 2012

ruthhutchinson 39 posts

Topic: General Discussion / carb free day

Thanks. I took some QA yesterday but it DID confuse the results so I started again today without adjusting. My last reading was 19 so obviously I need to increase BI. Very interesting.

Nov 11, 2012

emdj 6 posts

Topic: General Discussion / carb free day

I believe you need to stick just with the Levemir so you can see how it affects your bg over the time. If you bring in QA you'll have to start again with your carb free meal/day. It would be better to start such a day with a normal BG, so might be best to resume when you get that...

Nov 11, 2012

vic demain 87 posts

Topic: General Discussion / will dafne course help me?

Hi Jackie,

I've been diabetic for over 30 years now. Did the course in 2010 and learnt more about the condition in one week than I had in a lifetime before. You will come away with so much knowledge and probably a couple of new friends. You will be able to do things after the course which previously, would have frightened the life out of you.

Now the but, for me, my expectations were raised about the overall control of my situation. My blood sugar results had always been up and down and that remains the case after DAFNE. My Hb1ac results are little better now, despite working extremely hard on it.

That said, the course is a must do for all, unless of course they are not prepared to work at it. You need to put a lot of effort in and not expect miracles..

Good luck.

Nov 11, 2012

Ahmentep 99 posts

Topic: General Discussion / will dafne course help me?

Hi Jacks,

Welcome! Dafne has made a vast improvement to my life after 34 years as a type 1.

For all of those 34 years my BG levels have swung wildly and unpredictably from one extreme to the other. Dafne and its medical team have not cured that, and they have been unable to discern any pattern in my BG levels. Despite this, I have reduced my insulin intake by half and have a much more flexible meal/insulin regimen. I can now feel much more confident about going out.

It is vital to be sure you understand the DAFNE principles before leaving the course, and to follow those principles religously. Keep accurate records of what you eat and when, what you inject and when, what you do and when. Only then can you define with reasonable accuracy what adjustments need to be made and when they need to be made.

This forum will give you plenty of guidance, as will your DAFNE team.

Best Wishes,

Roger

Nov 13, 2012 novorapidboi26 1,819 posts	Topic: General Discussion / One unit of insulin to ten grams carbs ratio I think for most DAFNE graduates they will take a incremental approach to dose adjustment. If 1:1 (1:10) is not enough for you then you would increase that to 1.5:1 (1.5:10), this makes its easier to calculate more achievable insulin dosages, however some people do need to get there ratio to a more accurate number eg 1.25:1, 1.75:1. Any more precise than that and it becomes difficult to dose properly unless your on a pump. If several days results show you need more, increase by .5 units to every 10 grams....

Nov 13, 2012 novorapidboi26 1,819 posts	Topic: General Discussion / I did it :) Hey Nick, I am currently still in the process of getting a pump......... I was referred to the clinic after my consultants agreed I would benefit from one. It also helped that the pump clinic within my PCT had secured funding for 18 pumps just for the adults alone. Without this I probably wouldn't have even been considered. I was referred in July/August and I am looking to go on the saline solution test period mid January, so not too long in the grand scheme of things. The length of time it has taken is probably down to the business of the clinic with the normal appointments.. I hope it not too long a wait.......

Nov 13, 2012 Alan 49 284 posts	Topic: General Discussion / How many units of insulin? Also: If you don't have a pen that allows you to dial up half a unit of insulin, you should round up 4.5 units to 5 units.

Nov 13, 2012 Ahmentep 99 posts	Topic: General Discussion / How many units of insulin? Hi, Don't be frightened by this, but this is how it works mathematically. Insulin units = C/10 x R Carbs = I/R x10 Ratio = I/C x 10 Where C = Carbohydrate in grams I = Insulin in units R = Ratio ( e.g. 1:1) So, for the values you gave: C/10 x R (You only use the first figure (or the top figure, depending on how the ratio is written)) 30/10 x 1.5 = 4.5 I hope this helps for the future. Kind regards, Roger PS A ratio, say 1 to 1, can be written as 1 to 1 or as 1:1 or as 1/1 For a ratio of 1 to 10 these would be - 1 to 10, or 1:10 or 1/10

Nov 12, 2012 merstone 3 posts	Topic: Questions for HCPs / DAFNE view of Post-meal BG Testing Thanks marke. Signs of some research into the value of occasional post-meal testing were, of course, exactly what I was hoping to find from this thread. However, I guess that anything remotely conclusive in this area is unlikely, bearing in mind the longer term complications aspect would tend to make it as lengthy as the proverbial piece of string. I therefore wonder by who and on what evidence the post-meal BG targets published in last month's Balance magazine were derived?

Nov 12, 2012 marke 681 posts	Topic: Questions for HCPs / snacking and corrections Hi Gemsa, sorry bad news you are no longer 'normal'. What happens to 'normal' people no longer applies to you. What Carolin was trying to say was say you eat at 6pm, inject 12 units and have 120carbs ( where you are on 1:1 and 10carbs = 1 unit). If you test 1 hour later your body is still digesting the food and your BG will be higher than normal. If its 14 and you decide to correct and give yourself 3 units to bring you back to 5 ( generalising a lot about the exact effect of insulin), you now potentially have 15 units working on 12CP's which may be too much and will force you too low. Your QA insulin will generally keep working for upto 5 hours, this is the danger of injecting between meals. In an ideal world our BG stays within range after meals, but its not an ideal world so we are trying to make the best we can of it. If your BG is back in range before the next meal then generally you are doing ok. You can try to get better control than this but is very difficult. You don't have the feedback mechanism that a normal person has. You cannot secreet insulin at just the right time to balance the sugar in your blood, All you can do is put it into your body fat and let it be absorbed into your system at roughly the rate required. This is not precise but its as good as it gets with technology as it is at the moment. Maybe one day this will change but not in the immediate future.

Nov 12, 2012 marke 681 posts	Topic: Questions for HCPs / DAFNE view of Post-meal BG Testing I wouldn't say it is completely unnecessary, however I would also say it is not covered in the course because no research has been conducted to prove its benefits. Its nothing to do with test strip economy more to do with the don't tell you stuff that is not backed up by research, Thats the point of DAFNE it is all backed up by research. You will find loads of discussions on Diabetes sites regarding post-meal highs and their significance. However my personal view is most of it is not backed up by any real research just opinions. Whilst everyones opinion is valid, at the end of the day thats all it is. I have my own personal views but its not for me to tell you what is right or wrong. If there IS some solid research hopefully someone will respond with some links to it.

Nov 12, 2012 mum2westiesGill 502 posts	Topic: General Discussion / How many units of insulin? Thank you Marian!

Nov 12, 2012 NuMo 28 posts	Topic: General Discussion / How many units of insulin? 41/2 (4.5)

Nov 12, 2012 mum2westiesGill 502 posts	Topic: General Discussion / How many units of insulin? How many units of insulin would you have on 1.5:1 ratio for 3 CPs / being 30g of carbs?

Nov 12, 2012 mum2westiesGill 502 posts	Topic: General Discussion / Ratios / higher number of units of insulin DianeW said: Hi I think you are getting confused....1 unit of insulin would never be able to cope with 8 CPs. Whatever amount of CPs you have, you just multiply that by your ratio (i.e. 1.5 or 2 or 2.5 or 3) for example if you were on 1.5:1 and you had 8 CPs that would be 8 x 1.5 = 12 units. If you were on 2:1 with 8 CPS you would have 8 x 2 = 16 units. So it all depends on the ratio you are on. If you're still not sure then I would strongly suggest you talk to your own diabetic team who will be able to suggest the right ratio for you based on your readings. Thank you DianeW. Those examples you've given me are much clearer now x

Nov 12, 2012 DianeW 115 posts	Topic: General Discussion / Ratios / higher number of units of insulin Hi I think you are getting confused....1 unit of insulin would never be able to cope with 8 CPs. Whatever amount of CPs you have, you just multiply that by your ratio (i.e. 1.5 or 2 or 2.5 or 3) for example if you were on 1.5:1 and you had 8 CPs that would be 8 x 1.5 = 12 units. If you were on 2:1 with 8 CPS you would have 8 x 2 = 16 units. So it all depends on the ratio you are on. If you're still not sure then I would strongly suggest you talk to your own diabetic team who will be able to suggest the right ratio for you based on your readings.

Nov 12, 2012 pfordmartin 5 posts	Topic: General Discussion / Top 5 Takeaways from DAFNE Hi again all. I am inboxing some of you separately for your approval on quoting you in an article sidebar (Top 5 Takeaways from DAFNE). Thanks again for your input! Best, Paula

Nov 12, 2012 mum2westiesGill 502 posts	Topic: General Discussion / Ratios / higher number of units of insulin DianeW said: The answer to your question from your example woujld be 1.5:1. 1:1 is. 1 unit QA equals 1 CP *1 CP being 10g of carbs) 1.5:1 is 1.5 units QA to 1 CP (i.e. if you have 4 CPs equals 6 units QA 2:1 is 2 units QA for every 1 CP ( i.e. 4 CP equals 8 units QA) and then the ratios increase by half at a time Thank you. Do you have some examples like this going up for every 8 carbs 1:8 = 1 unit of insulin for every 8 carbs

Nov 12, 2012 DianeW 115 posts	Topic: General Discussion / Ratios / higher number of units of insulin The answer to your question from your example woujld be 1.5:1. 1:1 is. 1 unit QA equals 1 CP *1 CP being 10g of carbs) 1.5:1 is 1.5 units QA to 1 CP (i.e. if you have 4 CPs equals 6 units QA 2:1 is 2 units QA for every 1 CP ( i.e. 4 CP equals 8 units QA) and then the ratios increase by half at a time

Nov 12, 2012 mum2westiesGill 502 posts	Topic: General Discussion / Ratios / higher number of units of insulin 1:10 = 1 unit of insulin for every 10g carbs 50g carbs would be 5u what would be the next highest ratio / number of units of insulin?

Nov 12, 2012 Nick_G 6 posts	Topic: General Discussion / I did it :) Out of interest how long did it take you to get the pump? I posted the other day to try and gauge how long it'll take. My post was "Im looking for some advice from all of you insulin pumpers! I know speed and services can vary between hospitals but i wanted to gauge your experiences of waiting times. I completed DAFNE at University Hospital of South Manchester in September and following on from a meeting with my Consultant on Tuesday i have been informed that she agrees that i should be on an insulin pump and will put the wheels in motion to request the necessary funding from my PCT which is in the Macclesfield District.I have read that as long as a consultant diabetiologist says you require a pump then your PCT cannot refuse to fund it. Can anyone give me any advice about how long this whole process will take from beginning to end? I have been informed i will be invited to a pump meeting at the hospital at some point and once the funding is approed they will look to order the pump i want. Am i looking at pre or post christmas? Thank you in advance :-)"

Nov 12, 2012 Nick_G 6 posts	Topic: General Discussion / will dafne course help me? Couldn't disagree with any of the comments above! I've been Diabetic for 20 years and I learnt more in 1 week than I have in 20 years. My personal experience is a lot more freedom, flexibility and better Control which inevitably will improve my HBA1c. I approached the course thinking 'they cannot tell me anything I don't already know' .......how wrong I was.

Nov 12, 2012 DianeW 115 posts	Topic: General Discussion / will dafne course help me? I've been diabetic 32 years and did DAFNE in January and it definitely changed my view of diabetes. I had acquired bad habits, hardly used to test, never used to watch what I ate and now although far from perfect it has made me WANT to take care of myself, which is a big change in my opinion. I wish I had gone on something like it in the early days. I WANT to know what my BG is, I am curious to know if my carb intake is matching my QA, so I test regularly and thefore have better control. It gave me a much needed kick up the backside and it shows that even if you've had diabetes a long time and are stuck in your ways, it is worth going on and although it perhaps helps some more than others, it refreshes your thinking at least.

Nov 12, 2012 Garry 328 posts	Topic: General Discussion / Hypos and testing Good on yer. Regards Garry

Nov 12, 2012 merstone 3 posts	Topic: Questions for HCPs / DAFNE view of Post-meal BG Testing I noted that a recent issue of Balance magazine included a set of suggested BG targets covering pre-meal and also post-meal test scenarios. However, from my course, the DAFNE concept seemed to be that occasional testing for BG peaks (typically 2 hours after a meal) is completely unnecessary. So is the DAFNE view of post-meal testing driven by just test strip economy, or is there some recent research to suggest that provided DAFNE pre-meal BG targets are being met, post-meal highs are too short in duration to increase the risk of longer term complications?

Nov 11, 2012 ruthhutchinson 39 posts	Topic: General Discussion / carb free day Thanks. I took some QA yesterday but it DID confuse the results so I started again today without adjusting. My last reading was 19 so obviously I need to increase BI. Very interesting.

Nov 11, 2012 emdj 6 posts	Topic: General Discussion / carb free day I believe you need to stick just with the Levemir so you can see how it affects your bg over the time. If you bring in QA you'll have to start again with your carb free meal/day. It would be better to start such a day with a normal BG, so might be best to resume when you get that...

Nov 11, 2012 vic demain 87 posts	Topic: General Discussion / will dafne course help me? Hi Jackie, I've been diabetic for over 30 years now. Did the course in 2010 and learnt more about the condition in one week than I had in a lifetime before. You will come away with so much knowledge and probably a couple of new friends. You will be able to do things after the course which previously, would have frightened the life out of you. Now the but, for me, my expectations were raised about the overall control of my situation. My blood sugar results had always been up and down and that remains the case after DAFNE. My Hb1ac results are little better now, despite working extremely hard on it. That said, the course is a must do for all, unless of course they are not prepared to work at it. You need to put a lot of effort in and not expect miracles.. Good luck.

Nov 11, 2012 Ahmentep 99 posts	Topic: General Discussion / will dafne course help me? Hi Jacks, Welcome! Dafne has made a vast improvement to my life after 34 years as a type 1. For all of those 34 years my BG levels have swung wildly and unpredictably from one extreme to the other. Dafne and its medical team have not cured that, and they have been unable to discern any pattern in my BG levels. Despite this, I have reduced my insulin intake by half and have a much more flexible meal/insulin regimen. I can now feel much more confident about going out. It is vital to be sure you understand the DAFNE principles before leaving the course, and to follow those principles religously. Keep accurate records of what you eat and when, what you inject and when, what you do and when. Only then can you define with reasonable accuracy what adjustments need to be made and when they need to be made. This forum will give you plenty of guidance, as will your DAFNE team. Best Wishes, Roger