DAFNE Online iPhone application - help with content/design needed

Hi all, need your help/advice again.

After a brief iPhone development break whilst we upgraded the DAFNE Online servers, I'm working on the next update again. The first new bit of functionality I'm putting in is the creation of a meal - adding carbs to a 'plate' to count total CPs. First question - whilst you're looking at Carb information in the app, how do you want to add that info to the meal? Buttons with predefined amounts? Or a text box? Any other ideas?

Simon

Hi Simon, excellent app, thank you so much. One thing I would like is, during exercise and during night added to the "type" dropdown box

Regards Tony

Hi Simon, could I just add to Tony's request and ask for a "background insulin" option too? For example I take a split dose at 8am and 8pm, but that doesn't necessarily coincide with meals. When it does, the next meal of that type automatically adds it in. And as I'm sure I'm not alone in finding that weekday and weekend breakfasts often happen at very different times.... You see what I mean? I'm currently using the "other" option but a specific BI choice would be brilliant.

Thanks so much for a great app, couldn't be without it now!

Mel

Hi Simon,
I too would like to request a BI option and a During Exercise option.
On the Carb Counter/Plate idea, I like it, but I see some issues with it. Particularly as the Carb Counter info is a little non standard, and fixed.
Non-Standard:
Because the Carb Counter is not standardised to gCarbs/100g/ml for every entry, using a calculator can be fraught with issues. Personally I don't mind using a calculator, and always go by the packaging of a product in preference to the Carb Counter. The Carb Counter is a fallback for me, for various reasons.

Fixed:
Well, basically the Carb Counter uses the UK info. That is reasonably good, but differs a lot from other areas. For instance in .au, bread is more often than not 2 CP per slice, rather than 1.5. Also, there are "local" variations in products as well.

My suggestion would be to make the DAFNE Carb Counter in the App more variable, and tailorable to country/locality. It would need the backend database at DAFNE online to be able to accept info from the app, and the app would need to be able to download the country/locality data for the area you are in. This would be a great benefit in two ways:
1) Everyone could input food data from their area, and keep any personal recipes in their local app database (backed up through iTunes). DAFNE online would then become a live and up to date source of info for all foods, including international foods, and would quickly grow to be a fantastic resource for all diabetics regardless of nationality, and the app becomes truly international.
2) When travelling, you could update your country in the app, and get all the local foods data downloaded to you, courtesy of the locals.

The Carb counter would then be a truly up to date and fantastic tool for all of us world wide.

I understand that this is a pretty big step. The App needs to have some serious work done, and the Carb Counter database needs to become very flexible, as well as we would have to standardise on how the data is stored.

I would suggest gCarbs per 100g as the basis of every entry. Each entry can then also have a standard portion size (cup, spoon, pieces,etc) that can be used in a Plate calculation, or the actual weight can be entered, and the CP calculated automatically. We may also have to have an option for different units, like oz for countries that prefer imperial measurements, but that can easily be calculated on the fly. A setting in the app can apply the calculations, so even when travelling to a country with different units, you can choose to stick with your own.

If you need any help with the back end, I have copious years experience in IT development and databases. Don't have the facilities (yet) to help with the App. I would love to be involved in improving this whole aspect of DAFNE Online.

I must also add, you have done a fantastic job with this app, it is a small wonder how you have been able to keep up with our suggestions/requests. Well done.
Cheers

BTW, the app crashing I experience appears to be linked to the iPhone multi-tasking. If it gets "pushed off" the 4 app stack (rare), it tries to start from the "last point", but then crashes. This App isn't the only one I have seen this with. My GPS Navigation App (not TomTom) does the same, as do some others.

John,
The verified carb values on the website and thus in the app, are supplied by the DAFNE Programme's themselves so we cannot 'standardise' or change them in any way. On the site itself it shows you the AU carb
values and UK members the UK values. I'm not sure what the app does without Simons input. Although 'internationalisation' is possible I'm not sure how practical and desirable it is for most people. We would need to expand
the carb data substantially and that would rely on users to input it. Given that we have been running 2 years and there have not been a huge number of entries, thankls to those that have added entries though !, I'm not sure the idea would work. We how have 5 countires involved with DAFNEOnline which is again not a large base to draw carb info from.
While we appreciate the suggestions I'm not sure many will actually get implemented because of the issues above. Thats not to say we won't do them just I'm not sure how we can at this stage. There is no reason on the site that I cannot add a country field to the carb entry 'add' form since the database already has a country field. I would need to decide how to filter the output though. From the site perspective I will have a think about it, with regard to the iPhone App I will let Simon repsond on that.

Hi Marke,
From the user perspective, an expanded carb database is a good thing, especially if it can be expanded and updated by us. The issues I have with the carb database now are as follows, and admittedly they often stem from the whole "being in a different country" thing. BTW, I must point out that the Carb counter in the app is one of the best additions Simon has made, and the facility of the site carb counter to add entries is also fantastic.
1) Differences between "local" and "App" Carb values. This is probably be biggest one. I use the following sequence to determine foods CP values.
a) Packaging - Usually rely on the Carb per 100g/ml value, unless the packet is 1 serve. Most accurate.
b) App/DAFNE Carb data - If it is in there, I will use it. Because it does not include a Carb/100g or ml value, this often means some deft calculation. Not beyond me, but would be nice not to have to.
c) If I can't find out the CP from either of the above, I go with Calorie King here in .au. It is a very comprehensive and searchable database for most foods and products. The issue with it, and the DAFNE Online one, is just that. They are online. I live in a semi rural area in .au, and do not always have the coverage to use them. Home is fine with WiFi, but out and about is the issue. This also is the least used.

2) The non standard nature of the data. As pointed out, and as far as a know from the local OzDAFNE Programme, we mostly use the Carb/100g/ml values for CP calculations. It is much easier and often more accurate than the "Serving Size" on packaging, and usually included here as a standard measure. Even the fast food chains use it when advertising their Nutritional Info, and it is required here by law. However, there are some times where you need an idea of how much you are going to eat, so the "servings" in the database are helpful.

3) The lack of "Local" foods and foodstuffs. Now, I understand the need of having things verified, and I have no problem with it, but it seems there is often a lag between additions and verifications. Since we at this end do not know the process of verification, all we see is the lag. Also, there is data in the Online database that doesn't seem to get to the App all that regularly. This is also likely a person power issue, and totally understandable.

Perhaps I have not really explained my thoughts all that well. Do you have Skype? Could we chat it over?

The rough outline of the idea would be:
1) All records in the database have a localisation field. If the field is blank, the record appears in all localities. Otherwise, it will indicate which localities it is relevant and verified to.
2) Either Online or App can be used to "suggest" or enter a local food/product. When initially entered by one person, it goes into an "unverified" status. Remember, we users don't have labs, so we are getting this info from packaging, or producers websites. Once another X number of people have entered the same food/product, the food is placed in a "verified" status, and appears permanently in the Database and App.
3) To ease data storage and calculating the CP of any food, we use Carb/100g for solids, and Carb/100ml for liquids. Average food portion sizes, in weight (g) or volume (ml) are also entered, so the user can see both. So the display shows the Carb/100g/ml for each food, and the portion size, and the user makes up their own mind which to use. I am sure this is not a stretch from where the database is right now, but a particularly useful change given most (that I know of) use this sort of logic anyway. I am happy to be wrong about this.
4) If an entry is found to be wrong by a user, they can make a "local to the app" adjustment for themselves. If more users have the same "local to the app" changes, the entry is updated to suit. Remember we are getting the info from packaging more often than not, so a change here seen by many will cause the record for that food/product updated quicker for all.

What this does, is helps the Database expand and remain updated, without increasing the actual storage requirements, and without impacting the resources at your disposal.

I know this is a significant body of work and a significant change to both the backend database and the app, but one well worth considering, for both DAFNE and us end users. It won't happen rapidly, but it will be a significant change for all.

Also, the ability to select your weight display to match the country you are living in/travelling to is not of benefit to most I am sure. It is only useful to me rarely, when I visit family in the US. The issue is more the local foods reaching the App and online. You don't want the entire database on your iPhone. Just the "generic" foods and foods local to where you are, or where you are travelling to. The App could have a "multi-select" option so the countries you are interested in, or travel to the most, can be stored locally.

Wouldn't it be good if all of us Type 1s could be contributing something back to the DAFNE programmes we have gained so much from?

Cheers

Hi John/All,

This has flagged up a few problems with the existing implementation. I haven't looked much at the Australian carbs lit so didn't know how different it was. As a first stage I'll add that info into the app (I can't have 2 versions in different app stores) and add the ability to switch between the two. Perhaps even some clever country detection mechanism, but that might be pushing it a bit.

Regarding the portion sizes, I take your point that there isn't any one consistent mechanism, however broadly speaking there are two types of carb entries - those with portion information, and those with CP info for a specific weight/volume. So as there's only 2 types of carb entries, I'm sure I could come up with a way to add an entry to a plate by either number of portions or weight/volume depending on the type.

Looking at let you guys add your own carb info, this would be fine in the app - the only problem is if you wanted to sync to the site - it would potentially create a lot of duplication of entries, which at some point have to be verified by the DAFNE Dieticians, and as they have limited time it may not get done.

These are my brief thoughts on the matter - happy to take feedback / ideas on how to overcome the issues described, and I'll be tacking them in the order I've written them down, so that the Oz DAFNE Graduates can get their CP list in the app as soon as possible.

Simon

on the diary summary could you split the corrective counts and the bottom to number of ups and downs instead of just the total number of corrections, as when my HCP asked i had to do a manual look up.


Many Thanks

Hi Mike, do you mean to show number of QA correctives as well as CPs?

i dont think so on the diary summary at the bottom you have Corrective QA Counts (14 day) for Breakfast, Lunch, Dinner and Bed can you show the number of correcticve increases (+) and decreases(-) seperatly instead of just the total corrections for that time.