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May 7, 2019
torana
53 posts
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Topic: General Discussion / Dosage auto-calculation in apps Hi Simon Well done on the site. It would appear that the DAFNE app to upload blood glucose information is widely used and appreciated by members. I make this assumption because most members online have no posts against their names and hence would most probably be only accessing the app.I have one suggestion for the app that the location of the injection site on the app includes both the left and right side of the stomach. I alternate stomach sides weekly, using the top half for my quick acting and the lower section below the navel for the long acting insulin. Most diabetic educators have stated to me that the stomach is the most reliable area for the needle. |
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May 2, 2019
Simon
574 posts
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Topic: General Discussion / Dosage auto-calculation in apps
Still, this is difficult for some people - and I don't see why they should be belittled for that. Switching gears a bit, what was the constructive feedback you had about the app? |
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May 2, 2019
jh0
16 posts
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Topic: General Discussion / Dosage auto-calculation in apps
You can understand why. The App is offering 'medical advice' when it's not actually doing this. Importantly, given the direction that this discussion has gone in, people seem to think that it's ok to be considered literate even if they're innumerate. Basic arithmetic, barely number crunching. |
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May 2, 2019
Simon
574 posts
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Topic: DAFNE Online Mobile / Pulling BG from Apple Health Would people use this feature? For me I use a DexCom G6 which pushes my BG reading to Apple health every 5 mins. Given the right permissions the DAFNE Online app could pull your latest BG from Health and populate that in the editor when you're adding a new entry. If that's useful then I see it happening a couple of ways:1. A button on the BG row of the editor itself to pull the latest reading from Apple Health 2. A popup when you're adding an entry asking if you want to add BG manually or from Apple Health 3. Other suggestions welcome Let me know your thoughts. |
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May 2, 2019
Simon
574 posts
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Topic: General Discussion / Dosage auto-calculation in apps Just to clear up some definitions:Illiterate - unable to read or write Innumerate - without a basic knowledge of mathematics and arithmetic It's an unfortunate truth that Type 1 Diabetes doesn't choose to only affect those who are good with numbers. The dosage calculation in the app was intended to help those out with the number crunching needed to follow the DAFNE principles correctly. It did show all the working out that were performed so people could verify these themselves. As we have already described we were told to remove it as it meant that the app was classified as a 'medical device'. Thanks for the messages of support on this thread - it's great to know that there's people out there still getting value out of the app and site in spite of features needing to be removed. As ever if there are any specific features you'd like to see or feedback you'd like to share (ideally more specific than the App needs improving considerably) then don't hesitate to get in touch. |
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May 1, 2019
John Syer
19 posts
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Topic: General Discussion / Dosage auto-calculation in apps Oh wow!
So I guess we have the confirmation on my inflammatory speculation. Although I'm not sure that my 34 years since diagnosis as a T1, 8 years DAFNE practitioner, 25+ years developing software including 7+ in the biomedical field (including getting many medical devices through the legal quagmire that is FDA approval), and Beta tester for this DAFNEonline app qualifies me to determine that. The above mentioned life experience has taught me that there is no one "correct" way to solve a multi-faceted problem such as managing diabetes.
If you'd read this thread properly, you'd see that it was a post on the removal of the auto-calculation convenience functionality (3.5 years ago), that was forced upon the developers by MHRA (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medicines_and_Healthcare_products_Regulatory_Agency), although based on your posts, you seem to have a different perception of what is going on, or perhaps an agenda to push.
It would appear that your use of the word "illiterate" is a poor choice when I can only assume you mean "ignorant". But it does reinforce the inflammatory verdict. Now that you've stated that illiterate people deserve to be insulted, then you've really just escalated to online troll. Regards, John |
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May 1, 2019
jh0
16 posts
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Topic: General Discussion / Dosage auto-calculation in apps
I didn't insult anyone. But if you consider yourself to be literate when you can't do basic maths then yes you deserve to be insulted. |
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May 1, 2019
Theodore Taylor
2 posts
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Topic: General Discussion / Dosage auto-calculation in apps
Dude, Respect for the 30 years diabetes, sure you have a lot you could share with us (18 years now, but the first 5 i just didn't take care of myself at all) I feel like (perhaps not correctly) you might have a different view if you had a low insulin resistance as some of us do. Calculating 0.7 units to every 10g of carbs (absolutely solid for me) and logging the results in the process was absolute magic. I'm no stranger to excel, but it simply isn't as convenient as having an app that does both and syncs - giving you graphs also. The idea isn't to take away responsibility from the user, the idea is to make it simple and convenient for the user to calculate, log and manage their insulin dosage. It was a really useful tool for me. I owe a lot to it. That is not to say my diabetes management has got worse - I'm better than ever  - but it helped me a a lot in the early stages and I would totally use it again if it was available. Diabetes is a no-day-off illness. Anything that lightens the load, and helps us to live a more "normal" life is a god-send. Ps. Love you all, never let it get you down ;) |
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May 1, 2019
Annette Bell
58 posts
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What is your problem? If you don’t like the app don’t use it. The rest of us love it and find it really useful. Also, literacy is not to do with numbers. Some people with high IQ can have dyscalculia, the numeric equivalent of dyslexia. You don’t have to insult people who may have difficulty with numbers. This topic is now irrelevant anyway as the app no longer does the calculations for you. I use the app to show my diabetes nurses the graphs, which I also use to monitor trends and adjust my dosage when necessary. You’re happy using your spreadsheet. Great! We are happy to continue to use this great app as it is thanks. |
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May 1, 2019
jh0
16 posts
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Topic: General Discussion / Dosage auto-calculation in apps
Pardon, do you consider yourself literate if you can't do basic maths? That's plainly incorrect! Further, who said anything about paper diaries apart from you? The whole point here is representing the data of your condition in a manner which is lucid and transparent to both yourself and the medical staff helping to manage your condition. the diary can take any form. But if the diary is a black box (such as what you seem to subscribe to) how is that going to help you or anyone to analyse the condition in retrospect?
What's your point? The App is offering some half-hearted advice (quite likely flawed advice) and I can fully understand given licensing restrictions in place from the medical institutions, why it shouldn't be doing this without rigorous testing.
In my earlier post I've offered plenty of advice only if people such as yourself are willing to read and listen. 30 years diabetic, 14 years DAFNE, and 20+ years developing various type of software systems. I think that makes me quite qualified to comment on points raised here with your App. And what are your credentials exactly? |
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May 1, 2019
Pat N
12 posts
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Topic: General Discussion / Dosage auto-calculation in apps I have been using the DAFNE app for many years now. I find it more convenient than a paper DAFNE diary that I can no longer get from my health care team here in the SE, who no longer teach DAFNE.The app also gives me direct access to the DAFNE site enabling me to keep updated to anything new on DAFNE. I find the app very useful in keeping a record, track trends and print my diary before seeing my diabetes specialist or nurse. I hope this brilliant app will continue to evolve 👍 |
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May 1, 2019
Simon
574 posts
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Topic: General Discussion / DAFNE app for android That's about it - also provides some data and analysis of your blood glucose levels (charts, averages etc). Any other feature requests are welcome! |
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May 1, 2019
marke
655 posts
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Topic: General Discussion / Dosage auto-calculation in apps Hi, Thank you for sharing your opinion, i think what you need to realise is it is just your opinion not fact. Maintaining paper diaries might well suit you well that doesn't mean its the best solution for all. Also to correct you I don't believe illiteracy relates to not being able to do maths . I don't disagree that diabetes needs daily active management and that the App does not provide this it merely provides an electronic means of storing BG readings rather than writing them down on paper. It is an aid not a solution and was never intended to be.The App doesn't need to be condoned by a medical institution and was never not condoned. We removed the auto-calculation feature because that is classed as providing medical advice and any application that does this requires licensing and a lot of advanced testing that we as 'home' developers could not under take. Lastly are you a software engineer ? If not what engineering advice can you provide on the App ? Do you understand object oriented programming or REST API's ? If not you are no more qualified to comment on it than anyone else. We are always happy for offers of assistance or constructive advice that can benefit all users of the App, so feel free to offer advice. |
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May 1, 2019
jh0
16 posts
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Topic: General Discussion / Dosage auto-calculation in apps @JohnPeople must realise that controlling their condition is very much a hands-on exercise, be it via DAFNE or otherwise. I can't exactly say that I'm proponent of such a device that spits out some values to deal with the condition willy nilly. Does the app take into consideration past glucose readings to suggest the next reading? It doubt it. It's not that smart. It's imperative that patients maintain their diaries of CP and BG readings and that they adjust the treatment of their condition on the fly, adaptively, using common sense. The App will never be that smart to do this automatically. Instead you have to plug in fixed values of CP ratios at different times of the day into the App etc. Second if patients choose to remain illiterate then that's their problem. The App isn't helping here at all. Now I can fully understand why the App isn't condoned by the medical institution. Now, although the App can be extended in so many ways and made smarter, it could never reach the point of managing one's condition autonomously. In one of my previous posts I have submitted a template of a DAFNE diary in the form of a spreadsheet which has the purpose of representing the maintenance of one's condition in a more lucid and transparent manner. It's an adaptation of the DAFNE diary. Patients would be well advised to use a diary of this kind instead, and work on their condition in a more hands-on manner using some common sense along the way. NB. If anyone is looking for engineering advice on improving the App (considerably) then we can discuss it further. |
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May 1, 2019
John Syer
19 posts
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Topic: General Discussion / Dosage auto-calculation in apps
Hi jh0, This topic was started 3.5 years ago, so I'm not sure why you are adding to it now (unless it is to be inflammatory), but I'll jump in (rightly or wrongly) and "humor" you. As you point out, the auto-calculation feature was simply doing the multiplication of CP by the ratio to get the QA value. "... determining the required insulin dosages (multiplication) isn't particularly difficult to do yourself." Hmmm, not so easy when I'm low (or high), or add the complication of having a different ratio for each meal. The auto-calculation feature provided some convenience and ease, coupled with checking that the good old mental maths and App agreed for some piece of mind. Also, just to point out that the oversight has always been with the patient, this app has never interfaced with a pump - and the App is only as good as the data you give it. The patient CP estimation, or in your words "... calculating CPs (adding up) ...", is a far greater source of difficulty for most DAFNE practitioners that I know than performing simple multiplication. Who would have though that addition was harder than multiplication? Regards, John |
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Apr 30, 2019
jh0
16 posts
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Topic: General Discussion / Dosage auto-calculation in apps Could someone explain what the auto-calculation feature is?I might be able to guess what it is, but it's imperative that you the patient maintain the oversight of managing your condition rather than some device throwing figures at you. I mean calculating CPs (adding up) along with determining the required insulin dosages (multiplication) isn't particularly difficult to do yourself. |
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Apr 30, 2019
jh0
16 posts
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Topic: General Discussion / DAFNE app for android What are the functionalities of these Apps? What do these Apps actually do?It's manages your diary and lists the CP quantities for portions of foods? What else? |
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Apr 28, 2019
sjohno
37 posts
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Topic: General Discussion / Dismal Hba1c levels
Hi torana The DAFNE concepts suit my body, thinking, discipline and I like to think that I've streamlined it to suit my everyday life BUT it's not been easy  i.e. in November 2018 I broke my ankle, had to sit on my derriere for 6 weeks!! The battle was trying to sort out the BI and NovoRapid which took nearly 14 days to sort out and settle down 
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Apr 27, 2019
torana
53 posts
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Topic: General Discussion / Dismal Hba1c levels Hi sjohnoYour results are remarkable over such a long period of time and must have been a huge effort. Even more, it is both alarming and of utmost concern that your results are statistically better than 92% of Type1 diabetics in Britain! You may have individualised your “normal eating” and routines over time but I wish you had been at my DAFNE course for advice that works! Guidance for gaining long term low Hba1c results by what I deem “experts” like yourself would be of great benefit to the 92% of us out of range. |
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Apr 25, 2019
Hoddo
2 posts
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Topic: DAFNE Online Mobile / Dafne app on android Thanks for your reply Simon. Guess I'll have to be patient |
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Apr 25, 2019
Simon
574 posts
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Topic: DAFNE Online Mobile / Incorrect data affecting downloading, esp middle data? Hi Ivan, sorry I only just got round to responding to this - is your graduate still having issues? If so can you get them to email us at [email protected] |
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Apr 25, 2019
Simon
574 posts
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Topic: DAFNE Online Mobile / Dafne app on android Hi, unfortunately there isn't currently one available on the Google Play store - the previous version was developed by a volunteer (as it the rest of the site by MarkE and myself) who wasn't able to maintain it anymore. Mark is looking at developing a new version but he needs to teach himself Android development, as well as manage the site and his day job. I have experience with IOS and that's why that app is regularly updated. If anyone wants to help us out with Android app development we would be grateful for the support! |
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Apr 25, 2019
Simon
574 posts
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Topic: General Discussion / DAFNE app for android Hi, unfortunately there isn't currently one available on the Google Play store - the previous version was developed by a volunteer (as it the rest of the site by MarkE and myself) who wasn't able to maintain it anymore. Mark is looking at developing a new version but he needs to teach himself Android development, as well as manage the site and his day job. I have experience with IOS and that's why that app is regularly updated. If anyone wants to help us out with Android app development we would be grateful for the support! |
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Apr 25, 2019
Hoddo
2 posts
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Topic: DAFNE Online Mobile / Dafne app on android If the DAFNE app is unavailable for Android users can anyone recommend an equivalent Android appThanks |
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Apr 24, 2019
jh0
16 posts
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Topic: General Discussion / Dismal Hba1c levels There is no such thing as "true BG" readings. Perhaps you mean idle BG readings during fasting and running on background insulin alone.If you are concerned about the overlap of carbs and insulin in the system from eating regularly then let me explain. By eating regularly this is not to say that you're munching constantly (like in snacking), but rather you are eating at least every two to three hours or so and eating less. I draw a distinction between this and eating heartily every 6 or more hours (the typical traditional meal times of b/fast, lunch and dinner). |