New Needles - DAFNE Online

January 13, 2012 19:35

DRS DAFNE Graduate
Guy's and St Thomas' Hospital 6 posts

I currently use 8mm needles for my insulin injections. My GP's surgery have written recommending switching to 4mm needles which they say may help to reduce the amount of insulin I need to take. Does this sound right?

January 14, 2012 17:46

Alan 49 DAFNE Graduate
Maidstone & Tunbridge Wells NHS Trust 284 posts

That sounds like rubbish to me - you're still going to need the same dosage whether you inject it deeper with the 8mm needles, or not so deep with the 4mm. Perhaps you should get your GP to explain it.

I would recommend the shorter needles, though. I use 5mm needles and the actual injections are a lot more comfortable than with the 8mm ones.

January 15, 2012 10:16

LeonT DAFNE Graduate
University Hospital, Lewisham 6 posts

I think, and don't quote me on this, its to do with the shorter needles being more reliable at injecting insulin into your subcutaneous fat - the chances of injecting into muscle is greater with the longer needles which can alter the absorsion rate. Personally, I found that I not only needed slightly more insulin with the longer needles, but my BG readings were less stable.

Also, as Alan says, the shorter needles are more comfortable too. Give them a go Smile

January 15, 2012 18:22

DRS DAFNE Graduate
Guy's and St Thomas' Hospital 6 posts

Thank you both for your replies. Certainly the letter says the shorter needles are more comfortable - less bruising or need to pinch. Leon's experience also reassures me somewhat. The nasty suspicious part of my mind was thinking it might be a money saving exercise of some sort. Shocked

January 15, 2012 18:35

SimonC DAFNE Graduate
NHS Harrow 78 posts

Hi there, I was on the 12mm needles and changed to the 8mm, found them much easier, my GP wanted to put me on 5mm, but I was reluctant, so they didn't push it. I moved house last year, ands the new GP suggested the 5mm, so I gave it a go, and they are a doddle, even after the 8mm ones. Much prefer them.

January 16, 2012 10:08

novorapidboi26 DAFNE Graduate
NHS Lanarkshire 1,819 posts

DRS said:
or need to pinch....

that's very old advice now, you dont need to pinch with any of the modern needles now......

I am on 8 mm needles, the theory about different absorption rates in the subcutaneous layer and muscle is interesting though.....might need to investigate, although I am 100% confident I am not injecting muscle.....

January 16, 2012 11:33

LeonT DAFNE Graduate
University Hospital, Lewisham 6 posts

Give it a go. It might sound a tad far fetched but I definitely noticed a difference.

January 19, 2012 19:38

DRS DAFNE Graduate
Guy's and St Thomas' Hospital 6 posts

Thanks all. I have said I will try them

January 19, 2012 20:39

JohnC DAFNE Graduate
Northern Care Alliance NHS Foundation Trust – North East Sector Hospitals 2 posts

As regards your suspicions over cost, the shorter needles (up to 6.1 mm) are actually more expensive than the longer ones (6.2mm or more) under the NHS Drug Tariff.

January 30, 2012 13:19

jgibson1962 29 posts

I use the short ones, i'm a new diabetic (July 11) quite frankly i was bricking it when told i was going to have to inject myself, but these needles are so thin and short, i just dont feel a thing, although there are a couple of really sensitive spots. But yes i am amazed at the technology, i can even go out with friends to restaurants and inject discreetly whilst sitting at the table.

January 13, 2012 19:35 DRS DAFNE Graduate Guy's and St Thomas' Hospital 6 posts	I currently use 8mm needles for my insulin injections. My GP's surgery have written recommending switching to 4mm needles which they say may help to reduce the amount of insulin I need to take. Does this sound right?
January 14, 2012 17:46 Alan 49 DAFNE Graduate Maidstone & Tunbridge Wells NHS Trust 284 posts	That sounds like rubbish to me - you're still going to need the same dosage whether you inject it deeper with the 8mm needles, or not so deep with the 4mm. Perhaps you should get your GP to explain it. I would recommend the shorter needles, though. I use 5mm needles and the actual injections are a lot more comfortable than with the 8mm ones.
January 15, 2012 10:16 LeonT DAFNE Graduate University Hospital, Lewisham 6 posts	I think, and don't quote me on this, its to do with the shorter needles being more reliable at injecting insulin into your subcutaneous fat - the chances of injecting into muscle is greater with the longer needles which can alter the absorsion rate. Personally, I found that I not only needed slightly more insulin with the longer needles, but my BG readings were less stable. Also, as Alan says, the shorter needles are more comfortable too. Give them a go
January 15, 2012 18:22 DRS DAFNE Graduate Guy's and St Thomas' Hospital 6 posts	Thank you both for your replies. Certainly the letter says the shorter needles are more comfortable - less bruising or need to pinch. Leon's experience also reassures me somewhat. The nasty suspicious part of my mind was thinking it might be a money saving exercise of some sort.
January 15, 2012 18:35 SimonC DAFNE Graduate NHS Harrow 78 posts	Hi there, I was on the 12mm needles and changed to the 8mm, found them much easier, my GP wanted to put me on 5mm, but I was reluctant, so they didn't push it. I moved house last year, ands the new GP suggested the 5mm, so I gave it a go, and they are a doddle, even after the 8mm ones. Much prefer them.
January 16, 2012 10:08 novorapidboi26 DAFNE Graduate NHS Lanarkshire 1,819 posts	DRS said: or need to pinch.... that's very old advice now, you dont need to pinch with any of the modern needles now...... I am on 8 mm needles, the theory about different absorption rates in the subcutaneous layer and muscle is interesting though.....might need to investigate, although I am 100% confident I am not injecting muscle.....
January 16, 2012 11:33 LeonT DAFNE Graduate University Hospital, Lewisham 6 posts	Give it a go. It might sound a tad far fetched but I definitely noticed a difference.
January 19, 2012 19:38 DRS DAFNE Graduate Guy's and St Thomas' Hospital 6 posts	Thanks all. I have said I will try them
January 19, 2012 20:39 JohnC DAFNE Graduate Northern Care Alliance NHS Foundation Trust – North East Sector Hospitals 2 posts	As regards your suspicions over cost, the shorter needles (up to 6.1 mm) are actually more expensive than the longer ones (6.2mm or more) under the NHS Drug Tariff.
January 30, 2012 13:19 jgibson1962 29 posts	I use the short ones, i'm a new diabetic (July 11) quite frankly i was bricking it when told i was going to have to inject myself, but these needles are so thin and short, i just dont feel a thing, although there are a couple of really sensitive spots. But yes i am amazed at the technology, i can even go out with friends to restaurants and inject discreetly whilst sitting at the table.