think I cracked dawn phenomenon

I been doing dafne for about 4-5 years now and dawn phenomenon has always been issue. I have tried various methods to try to beat (e.g 3am tests, missing evening meal to see if background ok, little quick acting 5am to get insulin in system etc etc) but nothing seemed to work. I have recently (2 weeks) starting having a raw vegetable/fruit/nut smoothie for my evening meal and injecting accordingly and a eating normal lunch and breakfast, and apart from one day my blood test has not exceeded 10 (normally 6-. Which for someone who had morning tests exceeding 16 most days and playing catch up rest of day is a result. I can only guess this is due to the body not working so hard to digest. I know this approach may not be suitable for everybody but seems to be working for me and also dropping some much needed weight also , thought I would share.

You could also consider a pump if it's a real issue for you. A pump can be easily programmed to give BI at various rates throughout the day which is very small amounts of QA insulin. just something to think about. It's always great to get good results so well done.

Would agree with Andrew a pump is worth considering. Good results are always welcome

I'm glad you're happy with your work so far. Good work!

I'd imagine that your evening meal would not effect the dawn period though unless you were high over night post evening meal?
If you don't take 4 hours odd to digest food, it might be suggesting another health problem in the background (not dawn).
If not high post evening meal, are you correcting with your evening meal and finding you still rise during the night?

Are you able to share your BG diary to provide a clearer picture?

Sorry that the only replies you've had so far are pump sales people. Not everyone has the choice with their health team which some don't appreciate.

Take care.

Pump sales team??? I have recently moved to a pump. I had dawn phenomenon also and solved it very easily by increasing BI rate from 3 am to 7 am. Only trying to share my experiences which is what the forum is for. There is always more than one solution to any problem. ....

JayBee - I am not part of a Pump Sales Team - I am a pump user and have found it very effective in the management of some of the quirks of diabetes. Have you spoken to your diabetes team about it?

Hi, I wish I was part of the 'pump sales team' ( although the comment has probably been taken out of context), I have similar issues, my consultant has said he wants me to go on a pump but there is no money to do it so I have to wait.
Sorry but I also disagree that its another health issue, if it is then I have the same thing ! I am also struggling to find a solution and for reasons I cannot explain eating in the evening DOES affect my BG the next morning. Of course a Freestyle libre would help provide more consistent evidence. I had a trial one for 28 days and it showed the classic Dawn Phenomenon, but not every night which is why I'm not 100% convinced a pump will fix it but it certainly won't make it worse. I'm not sure I can handle the smoothie with raw veg in it though the fruit and nut I would love though.

I know that during my DAFNE programme some people on MDI s had their BI split into 2 rather than giving it in all one dose. Just wonder if this approach has been tried as some of the BI marketed to last 24 hrs has been found not to be the case.... of course if your BI is taken in the evening or night this would not be the cause.... its hard to try and assist without knowing all of the facts and everyone reacts differently to meds.can you provide any more info?? Andy

Just in reply to all the posts. I have tried missing meal and monitoring and endless amounts of 3am tests and early morning tests and tests just spike erratically post between 5am - 7.30am with no particular pattern. I am also on split background with dose adjustments and tweaks made over the years (dafne now going on 5 years) to try to reduce phenomenon impact with no joy. I have been diabetic for 38 years now and I am of the believe we are all individual and what works for one may not work for all. This approach may not be suitable for all but for me it does, and for last two weeks morning test has been on target 7-8 with only twice being 10 (I could have only dreamed of tests like that at the beginning of the year). As far as pump approach, I was offered to go on waiting list due to phenomena, but I did decline as for me personally I don't like idea of being attached and injections are a way of life now, and also guy at work got pump and not been good advert for me as he always fiddling with it, and don't like look of tube hanging out as I am very clumsy. I am really upbeat at moment and can't wait for my next hb1ac test at checkup!